Force Majeure under UCP 500 vs. ISP98 in relation to the Sep

DimitriScoufaridis · Post by **DimitriScoufaridis** » Thu Jun 06, 2002 1:00 am

This is an interesting discussion that contains more than an issue.

A. The definition of Force Majeure.
As already mentioned by Laurence, Article 17 includes wars as one of the impediments. In addition, in a special report on “Terrorism, force majeure, and letters of credit” written by Brooke Wunnicke in the DC Insight VOL 7, Issue No. 4, October-December 2001, war is included in the force majeure list, whereas the terrorist attack according to the author is a necessary addition to the traditional list; therefore, if the Sept. 11th terrorist attack is considered an act of war, then a bank that had its office in one of the collapsed Twin Towers would properly make use of this article.

B. Risk Management under Force Majeure.
T.O. Lee,
The points you’ve made are very clear and I fully agree with you. In fact in your last October’s Trade Finance Risk Management Seminar in Jeddah, you had rightly mentioned that buyers and sellers who want to have a better protection under Force Majeure have to name the impediments in their contracts.

C. The need to revise Article 17.
a. To become in line with ISP98 rule no. 3.14? We seem to agree that there is no imminent need.
b. To become clearer as far as the interruption of business is concerned. Isn’t such interruption defined by “Acts of God, riots, civil commotions, insurrections, wars or any other causes beyond their control, …”? What might be needed instead is a more detailed listing of impediments; the terrorist attacks certainly becoming a necessary addition.

T.O.Lee · Post by **T.O.Lee** » Thu Jun 06, 2002 1:00 am

DimitriScoufaridis

Thanks for your support. When shall we meet again in KSA?

Laurence,

Without your explanation, soley "on the face" of the title "Germany v. Ireland Result Spoiled by English" I would have thought that the English referee did the damages to the game, such as by giving 11 red cards to the German players.

But the umpire should not be English due to conflict of interest.

To test your lateral thinking skills, how would you interpret this title:

"Germany v. Ireland Result Spoiled by China"

T. O.
www.tolee.com

[edited 6/6/02 7:39:00 PM]

larryBacon · Post by **larryBacon** » Fri Jun 07, 2002 1:00 am

T.O.

It must be too early in the morning for me, but I can only think that as the Irish are famous tea drinkers, the China used at the World Cup was less than perfect !
If you had something else in mind, please let me know.

Laurence

T.O.Lee · Post by **T.O.Lee** » Sat Jun 08, 2002 1:00 am

Laurence,

Yes, you are right, an Irish spactator threw his China tea pot at one striker from the Germany side who was about to kick the ball into the net and the goal was destroyed. The referee did not know what to do, give a 12 yard penalty to Irelabnd? but this is not fair as no player was at fault.

In an email to Leo Cullen of DC Pro on 7th June, I guessed that Brazil would win by 4:0. This time my hunch is right. I am glad that the China team played better than the first game.

Without any responsibility on my part (to quote a famous disclaimer used by Jeremy) I guess the final will be Brazil v. Germany or Italy.

www.tolee.com

[edited 6/26/02 3:52:39 PM]

larryBacon · Post by **larryBacon** » Mon Jun 10, 2002 1:00 am

T.O.

thanks for making a mockery of the crockery !

I would agree with your selection of Brazil for the final, but would have serious doubts about Germany & Italy. Germany may not even make it into the next round. I would not be surprised if Cameroon beat them tomorrow. With Croatia beating Italy, their chances are also in question.

Laurence

T.O.Lee · Post by **T.O.Lee** » Tue Jun 11, 2002 1:00 am

Laurence,

Your remarks about Germany are answered today by the results. Now we wish Ireland the best of luck to enter the final 16th.

T. O.

T.O.Lee · Post by **T.O.Lee** » Wed Jun 26, 2002 1:00 am

Laurence,

Do you remember our exchange of views on the result of the World Cup 2002 Final? Here they are:

My views made on 8th June 2002

"Without any responsibility on my part (to quote a famous disclaimer used by Jeremy) I guess the final will be Brazil v. Germany or Italy".

Your response on 10th June 2002

"thanks for making a mockery of the crockery !

I would agree with your selection of Brazil for the final, but would have serious doubts about Germany & Italy. Germany may not even make it into the next round. I would not be surprised if Cameroon beat them tomorrow. With Croatia beating Italy, their chances are also in question".

Watching the games so far, we now realise that it is no use to control the ball for 65% of the time. The winner is the team who has one or more of its players who has the capability to make full use of a suddenly emerged opportunity and manages to put the ball into the net, whilst the goal keeper on the other side is not performing at his peak at that particular moment.

And Brazil is good at this, compared with the rest of the teams. Many goals were won in this way, such as today's Brazil v. Turkey. Turkey did perform but the second condition was not met as the goal keeper from Brazil was at his peak at those particualr moments.

Therefore, I guess the result of the World Cup 2002 Final will be Brazil v. Germany 3:1. 3R each will have one score; one in first half and two in second half.

From Turkey's performance today, it should deserve the third place.

www.tolee.com

[edited 6/26/02 4:07:44 PM]

larryBacon · Post by **larryBacon** » Wed Jun 26, 2002 1:00 am

T.O.

2 out of 3 is not bad. My comments on Brazil & Italy were correct. Germany, unlike Brazil, did not win all their matches and after the first round, only scored 1 goal in each match. They were fortunate in the draw to meet comparatively weak teams like Paraguay, USA & S. Korea, none of which were expected to reach the second round.

However, Germany have a good defence, so far only conceding one goal (Ireland, of course), so Brazil will find it difficult to play the type of game they enjoy.

Laurence

T.O.Lee · Post by **T.O.Lee** » Sat Jun 29, 2002 1:00 am

Laurence,

My guess on 26th June 2002 is not bad.

"From Turkey's performance today, it should deserve the third place".

Hope my guess for tomorrow Brazil v. Germany 3:1 is also OK.

www.tolee.com

[edited 6/29/02 2:55:16 PM]

T.O.Lee · Post by **T.O.Lee** » Mon Jul 01, 2002 1:00 am

Now the games are over, and in guessing the winners in World Cup 2002, we are quite close. Our hunches for the outcomes of DC litigations for our customers are, touch wood, also equally close. We never take a losing case. That is why our customers are, touch wood again, never defected in the courts of law. Sometimes they may have draw settlements outside the courtrooms.

www.tolee.com

[edited 7/1/02 3:35:41 AM]